Interview #2:
Ellis Nassour, Author
Honky
Tonk Angel: The Intimate Story of Patsy Cline
The first Patsy Cline biography, originally published in 1981, now in its
3rd edition
Author Ellis Nassour (standing) with veteran talk show host Joe Franklin in September on the late-night Joe Franklin Show nationwide Tribute to Patsy Cline (on her birthday anniversary) from New York.
How and when did you become a Patsifan?
Surely when, in high school, I worked in a record store in Vicksburg, MS in the late 50s and early 60s. In November, 1962, I had the great opportunity of meeting Patsy while I was at the University of Mississippi and booking entertainment into several Deep South colleges, but my real knowledge of PC came in 1970 when, as director of artist relations for Decca/MCA Music/Universal Studios, I met and worked extensively with Loretta Lynn -- and Owen Bradley! It was LL who introduced me to Patsy's husband, who later sat for an interview and arranged for me to speak with Hilda Hensley. It was also through Loretta that I met Brenda Lee and the Wilburn Brothers, Doyle and Teddy. Nine years after meeting and working with Loretta, I did a series of four magazine articles, the first written about PC since her death. That was what led to my first PC biography.
Was there one single thing in particular that prompted you to write a book about Patsy?
The fact that she had been such a pioneer and had virtually been forgotten...
What is it about Patsy that made her such an interesting subject for you to pursue?
She had so many colorful aspects, you couldn't help but like Patsy. She could be sweet and thoughtful and then cuss up a storm and then be mean as hell if she felt the need. I think what I found most fascinating was her attraction to Gerald; and then how she completely changed when she married her second husband. She also just loved her two "young'uns."
How did you create the book? Did you start with the ending, the middle, or from the beginning? Did you set up the layout first, then write within that layout, or was it more piecemeal?
There was nothing piecemeal about the book. So other than that, ALL OF THE ABOVE. As a veteran of The New York Times, I was adept at interviewing and research. I think my easy manner, perhaps from my Southern upbringing, made people comfortable talking to me. Having Hilda's seal of approval also meant a great deal and opened a lot of doors.
During your research, did you run into any major problems that made you fear that this book wasn't going to happen after all?
NO. The magazine articles proved very popular and were the basis for my proposal to the book publishers. Of course, once it began to circulate, the book was rejected by about eight major houses! They didn't know who PC was and didn't think anyone would care.
What most surprised you to learn about Patsy during your research?
After PC's death, except for two extensive but superficial album liner notes, very very little was written about PC until she was named to the Country Music Hall of Fame in '73, and very little then. So I began my research for the book very much in the dark about the REAL PC, and I was amazed at the strong opinions people had of her, especially in her hometown. When I mentioned this to Hilda, she told me that's the way it always was. That Winchester never really took to Patsy, even after she achieved her fame.
Are there any little nuggets you can share with us that didn't make it into your book?
SEVERAL, but I won't share them now because I didn't feel comfortable sharing them then. Mainly because Patsy's children never really knew their mother. I think, if you are ethical, you draw the line somewhere. Though he evidently doesn't think so, I was very fair and objective toward her husband. He was the man Patsy loved above all others, and the father of her children. If someone said anything negative about him that got in print, and the name of the person I interviewed was there; if anyone said anything positive about him, I also printed it. Several people -- women as well as men -- made some startling comments about Patsy, comments that I wouldn't dignify by printing. The biggest "surprise" was my interview with Faron Young. He went on for over two hours, sometimes with me on the floor laughing. It was the one interview that I REALLY had to clean up. I could never have put it in the book the way he spoke it. I still vividly remember coming out of his office over at Music City News in Nashville red in the face and thinking, "How in the world will I be able to put that in the book?" When the book came out, maybe after Faron was confronted by Patsy's husband, he denied he did the interview and told a paper in Dallas that I made it all up. When they called me to get my side, I played them the tape. And that was the end of that. Sorry to say, Patsy's husband faults me for things others have said, and I don't think he sees that I tried very hard to be fair. Of course, I don't walk in his shoes.
Whom did you most enjoy interviewing as you conducted your research on Patsy?
Hilda, #1, Patsy's husband, #2 and a fascinating woman who really befriended the couple when they moved to Nashville, Pearl Butler, who with husband Carl, was a major country star. I was greatly impressed with Kathy Hughes (Randy's widow) and her total honesty; and Dottie West and Brenda Lee gave a great deal of their time because they believed in the project.
Any eerie findings or happenings during your research?
Yes, when Dottie West told me of Patsy's premonition of an early death. That has always stayed with me. I heard about eerie things that happened to people who lived in the "dream house" and there were Loretta's stories about how she felt Patsy was guiding her from the grave.
How long did it take you to write the first edition?
Nine months.
There's some confusion out there as to why your book differs with the boxed set on the date of Patsy's first session. Could you explain that?
YES, THE BOXED SET IS WRONG. The information I got was in the files at the Country Music Foundation, the very same organization that put the souvenir book in the box set together, with material from my book, and my information came from Owen Bradley's very own records of the sessions.
Did you really write that fan letter in your book to Patsy, and did she really write you back?
She not only wrote back, but I knew Patsy from a couple of concert dates in December '62 and January '63. As I think the recent "Letters" book showed, Patsy loved her fans and enjoyed writing them, often late at night from wherever she was and often on the hotel stationery. She also enjoyed calling them and talking for a half hour or more, as the story of fan Louise Seger bears out.
In your book it says that Randy Hughes' Piper Comanche was green and white, but in the article in The Nashville Banner of March 6, 1963, it says that the plane was yellow...?
Not according to Kathy Hughes, my source, along with the insurance company records, for information regarding the plane. It was green and white when Randy bought it and he never had it painted.
Are you considering doing another edition of your biography in the future?
There will not be another biography, but there are plans to update my '93 Collector's Edition and restore all the photos and graphics.
How do you feel about the biographies written by Mark Bego and Margaret Jones?
I never discuss the ethics and working habits of MB, as his reputation speaks for himself. If you want to see what kind of writer he is, all you have to do is compare my book to the information in his book. At the very least, Margaret Jones, at the urging of her publisher, did list references in the back of her book to information she took from my biography. However, she should have added another 20 or so! It's a fact of life that once someone writes a biography, it will be used as "reference" for all other biographies. You may not like it, but there's nothing you can do. However, I am very pleased to note that I have NEVER received a negative letter about my book from Patsy fans. Just the opposite. The oral histories I gathered from those who knew Patsy, especially her mother, and how I shaped them seemed to have struck an emotional chord with the readers. I think that is one reason why the book is still selling.
What makes your book "head & shoulders" above other books about Patsy? How is it unique?
It was the first and, to date still, the most definitive biography. It is the only book for which Hilda, Dottie, Gerald, Jean Shepard, Faron Young, Patsy's husband, and so many of Patsy's home area friends were interviewed. Plus I was lucky enough to stumble on Patsy's diaries and was smart enough to buy up all the great photos!
Are there any Patsy Cline recordings that you've heard that haven't been released?
Not recordings, but audio tapes.
What Patsy discovery do you wish someone would find?
Her appearance on American Bandstand. And the negative of the film she and Dottie made in Florida.
What's your favorite Patsy song from the Four Star years? And the Decca years?
1) "Fingerprints"; 2) "He Called Me Baby."
Can you remember the first Patsy song you ever heard?
Sure. "Come On In."
Which Patsy session would you love to go back in time and attend?
"Faded Love." And what a thrill it must have been to be at that session, when Patsy was still recovering from the auto accident, on that Sunday when she recorded "Crazy."
Which Patsy concert would you love to go back in time and attend?
Carnegie Hall.
To what do you attribute Patsy's continued popularity?
Her voice really delivered the full intent of what the songwriters wrote, and the quality and innovation lavished on her sessions by the real genius behind Patsy, Owen Bradley. Harlan Howard said something interesting, that no one but Patsy sang his songs the way he felt they should be sung. And he added that once or twice he didn't realize how he wanted a couple of his songs sung until he heard Patsy sing them.
Do you have any info as to what Patsy's sister Sylvia and brother John are doing these days?
The family is intensely private, and I have always abided by their wishes to keep it that way. Sylvia and Sam keep a very low profile. Sylvia lives in Woodstock, Virginia and John lives nearby in West Virginia. I saw Sylvia last Fall and said hello, but I don't know if she knew who I was (maybe it was just as well). Everyone is wondering what will happen to the contents of Hilda's house (especially the hundreds of outfits she made for Patsy) now that it has been sold to the an entity that is trying to create the long, long overdue Patsy Cline Museum.
Have you ever met Julie or Randy, Patsy's children?
I respect their feelings and have made a serious attempt never to comment on this.
What are you working on now?
A new book and TV project.
What do you think Patsy's life teaches us?
Her life: YOU CAN MAKE DREAMS COME TRUE, and when they come true you might have some regrets.... Her death: God's plan for us is truly mysterious.
If you could speak with Patsy now, what would you say?
"Howdy, Hoss!"
Did you know... that Ellis nominated Patsy to the Cowgirl Hall of Fame? It's true!
Copyright © 1998 Patsified! All rights reserved.
